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Thames Ironworks 12:42 Mon Feb 16
Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

Before I begin I do not pretend to be an expert neither do I have statistics to back up my post, hence the reason it is posted as a question.

What I have heard from others has been a concern that with Allardyce as manager that youth talent in a squad is commonly not utilised by him and the ability to develop a squad is not his strength. Now it is clear that we rarely see young players given chance and while at this point of time a striker (again) is a priority signing we do have youth players who are not used. Is this not a sign that talent at the club is being eroded? Already we see a lot of the promising youngsters who have been at the club for a good spell moved on, Turbot and Fanimo this year.

Further to any discussion on talent erosion, I look to the start of this season where it was clear that Sakho and Valencia were a force. Coupled with Downings find of form and change of position we definitely started this season at a gallop. Many praised the attacking coaching of Sheringham, many clearly looked at the talent of the individuals and the extra quality they have brought to the squad. Yet now and after the West Brom game there was a lot of lethargy in the squad. There has been a gradual deterioration and maybe that is just tiredness, or is it that Allardyce seems to have a style that does erode the talent of these players. I feel it is not the first time a player has looked promising and then over time becomes a journeyman. Vaz Te, Zarate etc?

Again I cannot talk about this subject in confidence, but does it seem that with Allardyce as manager you start to see players deteriorate?

BRANDED 12:43 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

Sounds a bit silly.

Lee Trundle 12:43 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

It was decided Turbot had no PLAICE in the squad, therefore the best decision was for him to move on.

Thames Ironworks 12:44 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

haha Turgott (damn autocorrect).

Oh I add Song to the list, seems to have dropped down a peg.

whufcroe 12:47 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

What English Premier League sides or even Championship sides snapped up this young talent we released?

BRANDED 12:48 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

And which players have played well this season?

stirlinghammer 12:49 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

That's an honest assesment Thames unlike most of the bolloxs posted on here.

Agree, he has taken a very short term view - there is no desire to involve the kids.

Private Dancer 12:51 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

All of this gets discussed on pretty much every day. Nothing new here at all,

alphaharps 12:56 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

unfortunately our kids have not been good enough for Premiership, and most not even good enough for Championship

eternal pessimist 1:03 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

Valid point TI. It gels with the Sophisticated One's discomfort with risk - don't trust youth. Always go with seasoned journeymen.

On a related note, look at his transfer dealings. How many players has he bought since 2011 which have been or could be sold on for a profit (ie. have been good value)?

Pretty much all of the 'value' in our current squad relates to signings over the summer, which we made after the transfer policy was taken.

Think of Carroll, Jarvis, Maiga.

The only exception would (possibly) be Downing - but he was bought to play on the wing, and his good form has only arisen since he was switched to the tip of the Diamond, but that has recently been wasted to accommodate Slowlan....

This season is rapidly turning into a wasted farce because of the stubborn dinosaur that manages us.

eternal pessimist 1:05 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

That should have read:

"Pretty much all of the 'value' in our current squad relates to signings over the summer, which we made after the transfer policy was taken out of the Sophisticated One's hands".

Darby_ 1:11 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

Sakho was a relative nobody from the second division before he came to the club.

Either he had a brief purple patch or his great form will continue into the future. If it does, who will have been responsible for turning him from a mediocre player to a great striker?

As for the kids, when was the last really good one to come through? Tomkins in 2004?

eternal pessimist 1:24 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

He wanted Connor Wickham instead of Sakho, FFS.

My point is that he is unable to spot long term talent and invest in it - this 'choice' says everything you need to know about that aspect of his management.

There is a reason why more than one team he has managed in the past gets relegated immediately after he leaves (Bolton & Blackburn). It's because he buys players of limited range and ability that can only play one way and sets up a team that can only play one dimensionally, so that when they are asked to play in a more positive and creative manner, they cannot cope.

The good start to this season was despite him - not because of him. He was under orders to play a more expansive game, and he did that for as long as he felt he had to, then reverted to type. That's why our season is going pear shaped.

Darby_ 1:32 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

Bad stuff is Allardyce's fault. Good stuff is nothing to do with him.

Pretty convenient for the Sam-outers, eh?

Nicey 1:38 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

He works with cast offs and has beens and tries to eek some further value from them. He does this well.

Give him money to spend and he will be on the phone to his pals looking for some over priced cast offs and has beens where no value can be added.

He has built a career on the first bit and finds himself out of work when given the second but.

Northern Sold 1:48 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

Still say he fell onto the Sakho-Valencia partnership by mistake.... If teh chuckle Bros' (Nolan-Carroll) had been fit by the start of teh season then those fancy free games when we played some superb stuff would in all probability not have happened...

eternal pessimist 2:13 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

Correct

He started the first three games playing Cole and Nolan, remember ....

It was only when Nolan was then injured that he reverted to the Sakho/Valencia,

Takashi Miike 2:19 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

only a cunt would not recognise the massive improvement of downing playing centrally, and then marginalise him by continually including the scouse carthorse


#overachievementisdangerous

dicksie3 2:21 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

Northern Sold 1:48 Mon Feb 16

Alex V 2:26 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

Sam's system does not utilise talent - it is employed to overcome the deficiency of talent in his players. Developing talent will do nothing to get Sam a result in the next game, so it is no surprise he cares little about it. Players don't improve under Sam because he doesn't need them to - he just needs them to follow his instructions.

eusebiovic 2:30 Mon Feb 16
Re: Allayrdyce and the erosion of talent?

You can't expect a never ending production line of great youth players who will go on to become first team players...

It's not like Ajax or Dynamo Kiev where they practically have the whole country to choose from.

Barca despite their cash won't come across another generation like Puyol,Iniesta,Messi,Pedro,Sergio,Xavi for another 20 years...

It's the way it is

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